The new Bail Yourself Out podcast is hosted by Kandice Whitaker, a successful entrepreneur, and specialist in navigating corporate culture. With a fresh new approach to maximizing optimal career moves - the Bail Yourself Out podcast is where the power lunch and the after-work happy hour intersect for dynamic business discussions in a relaxed atmosphere.
Follow us @BAILYourselfOut
Season 2 Episode 1 - "Keeping it All Together-Your Mental Well-Being and Work"
Guest Co-Host - Dr. Brenda Carter
Guest - Terry Johnson
Keep up with Kandice Whitaker and the BAIL Yourself Out Community Online
www.linktr.ee/bailyourselfoutpod
© 2023 Alpha and Omega Consulting Inc. All rights reserved.
The new Bail Yourself Out podcast is hosted by Kandice Whitaker, a successful entrepreneur, and specialist in navigating corporate culture. With a fresh new approach to maximizing optimal career moves - the Bail Yourself Out podcast is where the power lunch and the after-work happy hour intersect for dynamic business discussions in a relaxed atmosphere.
Follow us @BAILYourselfOut
Season 2 Episode 1 - "Keeping it All Together-Your Mental Well-Being and Work"
Guest Co-Host - Dr. Brenda Carter
Guest - Terry Johnson
Keep up with Kandice Whitaker and the BAIL Yourself Out Community Online
www.linktr.ee/bailyourselfoutpod
© 2023 Alpha and Omega Consulting Inc. All rights reserved.
Welcome to the bail yourself out Happy Hour Podcast, where each week we'll help you navigate the corporate jungle. Here's your host Kandice Whitaker is happy hour. I'm your coworker Candace with a K pull up a chair and your favorite drink for the bail yourself out Happy Hour is about to start now.
Kandice Whitaker:Welcome to the happy hour lounge friends. Have you ever wondered how your work environment impacts your mental health? According to the CDC, mental health issues are prevalent in the US affecting nearly one in five adults. In this episode, we're gonna talk about the significant impact of work on mental well being. So today's episode is really all about believing in yourself to make the right decisions for your life by showing up as your whole self and believe is the B and my bail yourself out frameworks. Today's guest co host is dei specialist Dr. Brenda Carter, along with our guests, licensed therapist Terry Johnson, we're going to unravel the complexities of the workplace and its profound effects on mental health. We're going to talk about the statistics that link poor mental health to decrease job performance, productivity, and overall well being so Terry's diverse roles as a therapist provides valuable insight into the demands professionals face and together we'll discuss our personal experiences, from code switching to navigating toxic environments and adapting to the ever evolving corporate landscape. We're here to share stories, insights and strategies for believing in yourself and thriving in your professional journey. Just wait until you hear Terry's insights on the potential toxicity of code switching y'all and we'll talk about workplace dynamics, identity and the ongoing journey towards creating authentic spaces. Lock it in for laughs wisdom and the magic that happens when business meets happy hour in the bail yourself out Happy Hour lounge people where you got it friends, you're
Unknown:You're listening to Kandice with a k and together we'll learn how to bail yourself out. B believe that you can A accept change as a natural part of any process. I inventory your strengths, and the strengths available to you and your network. And L learn from your experience and the experience of others.
Kandice Whitaker:Join your happy hour community family online with a party never stops. Check out bail yourself out on socials Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Tik Tok. We'll see you there. Hey, hey, hey, Happy Hour fam. This is your girl Kandice with a K in the bail yourself out Happy Hour lounge. Today is going to be a super awesome episode, I got my co host, my girl Dr. Brenda Carter. And our guest today is Terry Johnson. He's a therapist in private practice in the states of Maryland and North Carolina. So what do you want the world to know about Terry Johnson, welcome.
Terry Johnson:Thank you. So as you mentioned, I am a therapist in North Carolina. I forgot to mention Virginia as well. I'm licensed there as well. I'm a clinic director though full time, and I do supervision. I'll work like five jobs to be realistic. So that's something people should also know. But streams of income, right. And also, you know, your gifts will make room for you. So you got to keep a few jobs around whenever you want it. So that is who I am. I am a chill therapist, friend, brother, partner at times, it depends on how people be acting. But you know, I still bought the ticket all times. I think that's what people should know.
Kandice Whitaker:I love that. Thank you so much. The reason I felt like it was important for you to be here today is we do a lot of conversations here about work, right? Some of them are happy and go get in go make your money and multiple streams of income. And yes, you can do it. But then some of them turn really real because folks have situations at work that are awful. Like flat out awful. And I don't think we really talk about that. You know, we talk about toxicity a lot in regard to personal relationships. But we don't talk about that in regard to the workplace. And that is a thing and that happens. I'm reading a book right now by Elizabeth Labor called I'm not yelling. Really, really, really really, really interesting book that I found on LinkedIn scrolling. And a lot of Dei. People were like, fist in it right Let me check it out. I'm all down for a black book. The reason I'm bringing that up, is one of the things that she talks about very early in the book was about code switching, right? We all know what Code switching is how you talk at work versus how you talk to your folks, you know, the difference between my podcasts on business and everybody else's podcasts on business, because we don't code switch here. We show up as ourselves. But like, I had an epiphany. And I think I've changed my mind here. I, like many people of color, was trained to code switch and conform in order to get a job and to fit in corporate spaces. And very early on. I was very good at it. You know, wear that navy blue, you can trust me blazer, put on your good white voice, not too much bass in it. But you can have too much bass in your voice very sing songy. You know, this is my non assuming and corporate voice. That's corporate Kandice right there. But then, when regular candidates started eking through, I would get comments like, I'm confused by you. Right, and then was upset because I was like you why you're confused by me that this book made me realize, Yo, that's because Kandice wasn't at the interview. Yet it wasn't at the interview. But then even a step further. I was like, Wait a second. How are we supposed to be happy in spaces where we are basically trained to show up as what we think people would want us to be? They hire the person they thought you were. And then when your real self show up? With braids, nobody happy. Why don't we do? This was an epiphany, mind opener, Elizabeth Leiba. If you are listening, we got to talk. You changed my mind on this. What do you think about that?
Terry Johnson:I think it's interesting, because points of that is very valid. When we think back to as a culture, where we came from, we were taught to show up different, right, we treat our parents different than what we learned to treat our parents as now, because they were slaves at one point. So we had to deal with masters and stuff. So that relationship was different. We were never really taught how to show up for people that were not. So we never really had an authentic space. So then we just carry that over through teachings over the years, and then we show up at work one day and think that we still got to please our counterparts, because let's be honest, that's what we're interviewing with. Right? So we think that's how we need to show up. And in fact, there's still this sort of historic rooted issue with our culture that shows up, which is why we do it.
Dr. Brenda Carter:Yeah, I agree with that. And I think what makes it hard with it being trained is that it's hard to tell when there's been a change of the guard. Because I've seen like, even with my job, when I tell you I show up is branded, I show up in front of one department right? Now, it doesn't mean that there's certain things we don't like change for, for example, right? Let's kick in it, you're gonna get a different version of us than if it was all sitting in the pew at the church. Right? I'm proud this certain topics we may not necessarily talk about right? Now. I get that part. Right. But when you talk about being authentically yourself, I mean, and not changing your voice. Like if my voice is five octaves below yours, it is what it is, right? It does. It has no bearing on what I can do as an employee. You know what I'm saying? That's a totally different thing. But I do think there was a time where where he wasn't getting hired, if you didn't look sound feel to all of those things like them. I think that a lot of the work and that are proved the previous generation of black employees. I think it is finally bearing some fruit because yes, now you can go into work with your brains, right but somebody had to do that fight before we got here. Right and so you know, I remember when we couldn't come in as braids. But if Sally went to Jamaica and she came back with razors like oh my gosh, that's so beautiful. I know what those
Kandice Whitaker:braids on the beach but that tie had beads. Yes. Or
Dr. Brenda Carter:Brad was allowed to pull into the parking lot was black. So then Wu Tang. And I had to turn it down, though. And I'm like, Well, why that's my culture. Why I can't bless Wu Tang when I'll get looked outside at, you know? You know, so what I think now, some companies not all are starting to be like, No, we do want you to become as authentically you. But I think for us, it's a trust factor. Like, are you sure? Because I'll
Kandice Whitaker:trust it. Brenda, I hear what you're saying. But I don't really trust it. I don't particularly trust that at all. I have a young lady that I'm coaching for an interview for a top four consulting agency. And you know what, I gave her the code switching advice. Yes. What are your pearls? Yes. blue blazer?
Dr. Brenda Carter:Yeah. Well, here's the thing. It's better to be safe than sorry. Right. The good
Kandice Whitaker:way? Yeah. And guess who got off? Yeah,
Dr. Brenda Carter:I feel like it's better to be safe than sorry, that part. But I think this what I'm talking about, it depends on where you are in your career.
Kandice Whitaker:She's hard. I'm gonna say that that's a privilege. We we had to work our way through, we can wear braids. Now, I don't care. But I also have a skill set and say, I could bounce,
Dr. Brenda Carter:right? You have something to barter with that
Kandice Whitaker:part leverage. You need experience, and they gotta want you. So like, would you define that as toxic Terry is code switching toxic, in and of itself
Terry Johnson:can be toxic, you know, depending on what the purpose is, because we're code switching for less a big time law office or something that may be different if I'm a new attorney. But if we're, I'm code switching, and I've been in this field for 30 years, then, you know, there might be some issues, she'll say up that you got to work there, which could be toxic, because that could come from imposter syndrome, as well. But some people are code switching, because they don't believe in their own success based on what somebody else told them, which is probably our counterparts. Let's be honest, who hired them at the previous job? You know, so some jobs create a toxic environment, because they know people are code switching, they know this going into it. And they can see that I'm out of the way. So they want that person? Because yes, yep. So toxic, absolutely. very toxic.
Kandice Whitaker:Well, that's what she brought up in the book, right? She was talking about how she was even code switching at home. Like it got so much so pervasive that it was every part of her life. And I was like,
Dr. Brenda Carter:Yeah, and I think that leads to like, a really good question for you, Terry, when when you are in that type of environment and say it's for a long period of time, what does that do to one sense of identity?
Terry Johnson:That's a good question. So the identity can shift because if I walk into work, I use myself for example, and a previous experience. So if I show up into work, you know, as Terry, I'm happy go lucky. I'm a morning person speaking to all of my staff, but then I'm having interactions with people who are higher up than me, right, that are demeaning the morale causing that energy to default, it's gonna cause anxiety is gonna cause depression. You know, there's been people who have been in these types of environments where they're forced to show up not as themselves, who have taken on more than they could, because they're afraid to tell somebody that they can't handle it. Because you can't handle it means that I can't do it. So there's a lot of like toxic behaviors that are in roped amongst, with, like, people believing that you're one thing that you're really not. But that is so
Kandice Whitaker:key. I'm sorry, go ahead. I'm like dying over here. Because I feel like you described 25 year old Kandice. I was in over my head. And I remember saying to somebody like, Yo, I feel like I can't be myself here. And I remember this other black person saying to me, like, What do you mean you can't be yourself at work? I got a real Boomer response. You know? That was
Terry Johnson:a different generation.
Kandice Whitaker:Like what you mean? Like I felt like what was that movie? We got a good hidden nickel. You show him we got a good
Dr. Brenda Carter:one there time period. That was true. Very true, but each generation pushes it even further. Like I honestly I'm proud of and I'm super astonished. The generation that's behind us, because they're not taking any shit whatsoever. Like even us mentioning in your early career to pose which they like, No, listen, no, I will have you on Tik Tok and everything else. I will drag you out, you know, I'm saying, but I appreciate it because they're and I think part of it is cause and effect because it's like, patient, patient, patient, patient patient. I am patient no more.
Kandice Whitaker:But think about where we are Brenda. I've accepted the fact that I'm an elder millennial. We got our answers beat for this. We did a non conformance okay. We was not raised on hugs and quality time and shit. That was a different generation
Terry Johnson:that started around my millennial time
Kandice Whitaker:we got the you crazy. What's wrong with you? Why are you asking questions? Oh my god, I'm loving this conversation but I put a paperclip take a break right here. And we'll be back. So tell me are you enjoying the show? gone ahead and rate us five stars and leave a comment. Now back to the show.
Unknown:Get the 411 on bail yourself out Happy Hour lounge community by signing up for our community booster. And when you sign up you'll get a free download of your choice and you will be entered to win a limited edition Bail yourself out podcast t shirt you know monthly drawing Sign up today at bail yourself out pod.com We'll see you there.
Kandice Whitaker:Welcome back. Happy Hour fam. This is your girl Kandice with the K I am chillin in the lounge today with my girl Dr. Brenda Carter and Terry Johnson, we talking about your mental health at work today. Talked about toxic work environments. But I want to just jump right into how can somebody identify a toxic work environment when they're in it? Like toxic I think is relative toxic that I can handle might be different, I think from what Brenda can handle from what Terry can handle? I mean, am I right about that? I've always thought that?
Terry Johnson:Absolutely. Yeah, I think when you think about like a toxic environment, like there, there are key components to a toxic environment. You know, like being able to have flexibility on your job, let's say there's a family emergency that comes up if your boss is like, Oh, you need to put PTO in and worried about like the PTO request versus you taking care of your family, automatically, you probably in a toxic environment. Whenever your mental health is not the priority of your boss's conversations with you, that environment might be a little toxic, because a boss should be able to identify whenever team members, people that they're over, are having moments are struggling with something. And so being in a space where you have supportive leadership is gonna look completely different than a toxic environment where you don't, because you will feel stagnant. You won't feel yourself growing. And every day you wake up, you will hate showing up to work. But we fill up who's through it right for the chair.
Kandice Whitaker:That's the truth. I remember working at a specific place where every Sunday at three o'clock I would start getting a headache.
Dr. Brenda Carter:So let me ask a question, because I'm gonna play devil's advocate for a second, right? What about the people who call everything toxic? They get they get like some type of feedback. Oh, this is toxic, something doesn't go their way. Oh, this is toxic. You know, somebody tries to you know, do something with their work that needs to be done. Oh, this is toxic. So how do we separate because every like, especially, like, it's just big? What do you look on tick tock or whatever else? It is not necessarily toxic. It's just like, so how do we decipher between being like adult situations where this is what comes with being an adult? Right? And life is life? And then what's actually toxic? How do we draw the delineation between it? Yeah,
Terry Johnson:that's a good question. Because when we think of toxic, that is something that's going to overtime affect our mental health in a way, when we think of, you know, my boss is just weird. Like, that ain't affecting you. Then and the fact that you get over it, but I think that that also is speaking to like generations to again, like that is a generational thing that I'm seeing now with newer clinicians even is like, Oh, we don't get Friday's off. Oh, this is so toxic. It's like, but we got to work Monday through Friday because you need to see people on Friday, you know, and it's just like if there are reasons behind why an action is being taken and there's support being infused Then it then environment probably as toxic as the people are making it seem as it is. Sometimes people live with toxicity though from other places and they bring that to work. So then that part is toxic. And it's then this toxic therapist plugged me
Kandice Whitaker:one that's gonna be patient get down in their membranes and see what's wrong with you
Terry Johnson:give them break through, you know, but every environment is not toxic that people are you know, saying it's toxic because the idea of toxic is something that should be like a poisonous connection, which is also energy sources. So like some people that identify things as toxic, like their work environment is really they home like, you know, the negative thing today is well, now they just, you know, throwing it off on on their bosses.
Kandice Whitaker:I almost feel like it's the word of the day right now. It is like a culture, drama, toxic we'd be like Pee Wee Herman. Remember when Pee Wee's Playhouse they would have the word of the day. The word of the day is chair, data myself with that the word for the culture is trauma and toxicity. So like we find any way to incorporate that into a sentence so we can sound learn it.
Terry Johnson:Yeah, trying to sound informed. Right.
Kandice Whitaker:I read it on Tik Tok. What are you talking about? I saw a whole video on it. Yeah, like
Terry Johnson:on trauma, and now you're expert.
Kandice Whitaker:by someone whose credentials you know nothing about, then there's that part? Or they don't have them.
Dr. Brenda Carter:Most of that has not been validated at all. validated, you're like, Well, what does that mean? Ah, you probably shouldn't be used. And that's I blame when we did the switchover from the playgrounds as older millennials used to have to the super safe ones. I think that's what started it. That's why nobody can take a hit. Because we used to get on slides in the summer and get burned going down to all metal we used to get a was to mean that they get cheap. Yep. Yeah.
Terry Johnson:Fire blazing.
Dr. Brenda Carter:With plexiglass and the phone. I feel like that's what started that. So I blame the playgrounds. Oh, yeah,
Terry Johnson:you get scammed. So I'm gonna actually spring my leg because I was swinging on the monkey bars, like, you know, most boys do at seven years old. And my friend came behind me, you know, I used to play Little League game where you fight? You know, like, you will fight on my keyboard? Like, you know? Yes. So that would have been toxic, right?
Kandice Whitaker:I have a word for toxic, toxic, toxic,
Dr. Brenda Carter:toxic back in the day was for an environmental thing, like, you know, when you see the little triangle, and it's like, don't go here that is environmental, it was not like personal fact, that's a fact. Playgrounds.
Kandice Whitaker:It provides a different perspective of how you see things, because even kind of relating it back to this book that I'm reading. So it's front of mind. For me, doing code switching, making yourself fit in environment was normal. It was like, This is what you're supposed to do. Right? When you go to an interview. It's not the paradigm shift we're seeing now if you interview them as much as they're interviewing you. Right? It is, how do I make myself fit into this environment? And let's take that away. Let's talk about this in a different context. If we were talking about an interpersonal relationship, we can see how inappropriate that is right? You would never meet somebody and say, Hey, let me change the way I talk dress, the things I like, to fit a relationship with Mr. X or Mrs. X. In a relationship, it's very easy to see how jacked up that is, but somehow, in our culture, we've accepted that that is, or could be a normal to at least get your foot in the door in corporate America, not even corporate America and not for profits to be seen as acceptable. And I believe the paradigm shift is here. It
Dr. Brenda Carter:is. And here's the thing. I think it's the paradigm shift in examples, because I don't think before we don't show didn't have examples before, right, like the older generation of black employees. They were just doing as they were told,
Kandice Whitaker:lowest did that get them fired for no reason.
Dr. Brenda Carter:Right? You know, and because the economics and stuff like They were already going through a lot. So I get that, right. I think the exercise started pushing a little bit. And then here come the millennials. And we're like, whoo, bitch get out the way. And then the burn is, you know, but what, what? What else? There's more examples of self advocacy now than what I've ever seen. And like, even if I do it, now, you may not be able to do it when you're first starting your career, but like, for example, I've seen people mid career later in their career of black employees, who they will start to advocate for themselves in a certain way where the younger generation is like, oh, that's how you do that. Right? So they'll may slide in in a joke with their co worker, like, you know about the change my hair so and they're like, oh, my gosh, you changed your hair. So up in the air girls whacker all day, like, Oh, okay. You know, like the day I've been, I tell all of my superiors, so they're like, I'm talking about C suite VPS. One of them it was hot was at a party, and your girl was fully tatted. I don't look like I present that way. But my back is fully tatted My stomach is tattered. And it was in the I had on like a something over the dress that I have. But once you take the dress off the thing off, you can see the full mosaic, right? And I told my CDL is like, listen, it's hot. I'm let you know right now your girl was fully tatted. She's like, Oh, I don't care. It's okay. Drinks for everyone. I'm like, great. I like it. You going in that vein? Bother BP as I listen. I was telling them a story about how it's raining. I said, do you know about black girl hair? He's like, no. I said, Okay. Well, let me tell you. Well, water hits black girl here. Yeah. Have you ever seen gremlins? What it takes to tape again? clip that's me advocating, but doing it my way. So that way, you know, this is me. This is how I show up. And if you ever see the rain out, I want you to look in my direction. And I want you to be like, do you need
Terry Johnson:others? Yeah, that's being culturally aware, too. Because if we happen to know something about their culture, right, which we're in their culture, we're always mindful of their culture. Let's be honest,
Kandice Whitaker:where we have to be. That's the part that pisses me off, though. My cancer is showing up. Everybody know I'm a cancer. They say our toxic trait is we don't tell you what we need. Because we feel like you should know. This is where my cancer is showing up. No, you know what you are right? We do know about them. Terry, you know why? Because we can't even graduate high school without knowing about y'all. But you have the privilege of walking through life, and not even knowing the simplest things about Black culture. And they want me to explain it. Anything you want to know is on the YouTube as the old people was saying, you don't want to know. And I don't have the patience to explain it to you. God bless Brenda. She'll explain it.
Dr. Brenda Carter:That's where I tap it. I say every joy supplies. I got a kid just
Kandice Whitaker:sitting there lips pressed. Yeah. Okay. See me lips pressed.
Dr. Brenda Carter:Oh, school, church, mobile, it's pressed.
Kandice Whitaker:Patients. Anything you want to know was on the YouTube? Is there that whole conversation I wouldn't have the patience for but this is why we all need each other.
Dr. Brenda Carter:And they didn't ask. I was just telling them. I was just being proactive. Because I'm like, No, you're gonna get the full brunt. And I want you to know, don't ever host an event that's outside was random. I'm not coming. I'm telling you why.
Kandice Whitaker:He got it. Wrong. Wrong. You're not wrong, but they should notice. Yes. Okay. And I said what I said, all right.
Terry Johnson:When we think about the levels of like them, understanding our culture, it is a lot more asking questions and like conversations, and it's still about hair. That's the annoying part. Like why the hell are we still talking about Damn, hey, B, you know, we're having to explain our hair textures or hair types and stuff. You know that?
Kandice Whitaker:I don't like that. I don't like feeling like anthropology. That's what
Terry Johnson:it's like. It's almost as if, you know, you have to really like morph into how they show up. You know, like, oh, I go get my hair done once a month. Oh, well, I go every two weeks. Like but you should understand that being that you would understand our culture.
Dr. Brenda Carter:You know what was funny? So this was like, this was years ago. I was at my cousin's cook Girl and so, so my cousin, she's she's biracial. And so she had a friend who was in a biracial relationship. So the the woman was white, the man was black. And so they have biracial kids. And so the kids had, of course, more our hair type, but it was like that reddish hair color, which, you know, like, the reddish hair color could be even thicker, rhyming
Kandice Whitaker:with Oh, folks call it.
Dr. Brenda Carter:And so we were sitting down, like borderline fireside chatting. And she goes, You know, I don't understand why people spend hours on their hair. Now, mind you, the kids hair was like, according to our culture, not the right, like, wasn't paying wasn't nothing. And she was going on about how she doesn't understand. And she thinks it's vanity to spend hours on your hair. And that's why she doesn't do it with the girls because no one should be spending hours on their hair. And so I couldn't like I just, my ancestors and me rose up, and my eyes was cutting over. Nothing to like, and I'm sure they've had the conversation. But you know, I'm sure things go a little left. But he was almost looking like with the eyes, like, Please tell her. And I was like that. And so I was like, Okay, let me just help you out here. I said, my daughter's hair. It takes hours to braid her hair to get it tamed. I said, Well, you throw your hair in a ponytail, it will not be the same as me throw my hair in a ponytail, because it's not going to come out the same way. There are actual steps that you have to take just to get it tamed. That's number one. Number two, black hair is the most fragile. It may look like the strongest, but it is the most fragile, which is why it has to be taken care of. So you cannot just leave it out and about because it can break off. It takes no time for it to break off. So yes, even when you see people like myself or different little girls, and they are spending time getting their hair braided. It has nothing to do with vanity. It has everything to do with the amount of time that it takes to do certain things with your hair. It takes my hair longer just to get it that way. And let's just say you know the cricket sound. There was the cricket sound and the husband's eyes is given a standing ovation sound you know kind of like a sigh of relief. Everybody that was looking kind of slow looked at her children's hair and was like yeah
Kandice Whitaker:Okay, so here is Qantas is PSA. Y'all season diaspora and non I know we have some non who were listening your allies. We'd love you marry who you want. Learn how to do their hair. Yes and Amen. And we're gonna put a paper clip in it right there. We'll be back. Do you want me to speak at your next event? Hit me up at bail yourself out. pod.com.
Unknown:Let's continue our conversation on elite.
Kandice Whitaker:Hey, hey, hey, y'all. Welcome to our last break with my girl, Dr. Brenda Carter and Terry Johnson today talking about your mental health at work. We talked about a whole lot of things today, toxicity, learning how to do full care. It was a little smattering of what we did. But most important advocating for yourself in a work environment. So I want to talk about how does working in a toxic work environment affect someone's mental health?
Terry Johnson:Yeah, working in a toxic work environment can affect not only just your work environment, but also your personal life as well. Because as a person, you show up as a human first, in every aspect, no matter if he calls switching or not, he's still the same human. So whatever stressors that you you impact with, or you're triggered with at work, take all that home, so it can affect you. And being able to maintain relationships and build trust in people just in general, because the work environment that I'm in, I might can't trust my co workers, maybe they gossip, which we know that happens. But the level of toxicity that they could bring to a work environment could cause people to, you know, have anxiety, you know, every time they see somebody talking, they may think like oh, that you're talking about me, you know because of what we've created that culture to be. So it can lead to a lot of different levels of stress. Of course, stress can then lead to a lot of physical things as well. So then it goes into the physical health and then you just can see a person decline over time, especially if they've remained in that toxic work environment without any type of self care, or any type of hope, or prayers to get out of that toxic environment. You can We see a person decline.
Dr. Brenda Carter:What's the good self care regimen to kind of offset that? Because what if, you know, bills is still due? I can't get another job right now. So, you know,
Terry Johnson:yeah. So we there's, there's a beautiful way that our brain can allow us to process toxic environments and deal with them, similar to a child that grew up in a traumatic experience. So if they grew up in that experience, they may still come out to be a great adult, because they've done work, they probably go into therapy, that's also a self care tactic to do and a toxic work environment. Talk to your therapist. Yes, you know, doing stuff for yourself on a regular basis. So when you leave work, yeah, go to happy hour. Yeah, absolutely. Go have a, you know, on a Wednesday with your friends, or go to the gym, you know, on a regular schedule, you know, eat healthy foods and try to just keep yourself motivated. So that way, you're not as broke down as it actually feels inside maybe. So that way you have something to offer to the next position, because it'll come if you want a
Kandice Whitaker:very specific question, because this brings to mind a toxic work environment that I had in my path. I worked at an organization where it was very prestigious, so many people wanted to work there. And it was killing me. It just didn't fit for me, it was killing me, actually started seeing what you're talking about the physical manifestations. I was going to my personal physician who worked for the organization who ended up just saying to me, you need a new job. You need a new job, there's nothing wrong with you, you need a new job. And there was a part of me because younger Candice wanted to keep this job that had a pension that I got that when I was 25. I couldn't understand why I could not stuffed myself into what they needed me to be so I could be okay. And when my doctor said that, to me, it was like my eyes were open to what was around me. I was like, you know, these people were unable to conform and be happy here. How did I know that? Because everybody was sick. Every other week we was taken up offering for somebody who had cancer. People coming in IV bags, pots on gurneys and wheelchair. Yeah, last to me bag.
Dr. Brenda Carter:The desk Excuse me, sir, can you move your bag out the way?
Kandice Whitaker:It was like that was there the whole time? And I was like, you know, everybody was saying, Oh, this is a sick building? No, it's not a sick building. This is a sick place. Yeah,
Terry Johnson:the culture is sick. And they created very sick.
Kandice Whitaker:It was unbelievable. And when I quit, thank God, through the power of prayer and belief in myself, I got something else. And people came up to me and asked me, Why are you leaving? I was like, Are you serious? Sucks here, you know that?
Terry Johnson:Like, they don't know, like, work at the same damn place I work.
Kandice Whitaker:When I said it there was like, Oh, you're honest. So that's one thing about our culture. Ask us stuff you already know the answer to
Terry Johnson:because it will annoy us real quick.
Kandice Whitaker:That part that part. But seriously, though, when you're in a place that's toxic, sometimes especially if it is a place of some prestige or you have good benefits or it is comfortable for your life. It is easy to try to push yourself into neutral and say okay, let me accept this. But that comes at a price. Right?
Dr. Brenda Carter:What kind of like a relationship let's say you got like somebody who's with somebody for the sake of money, the comforts that part then you got to deal with some of the other stuff that goes with that. And so you can just trade off or you're like well think about who is it Maslow's order of needs? You're like well, what's on the top for me is my comfort or my financial stability and I'm not taking away from that right because we listen you know by trying to be broke them all right, let's get that straight.
Kandice Whitaker:But that's why we have our own
Dr. Brenda Carter:but that's what I'm saying, right, like, so you you look at what you need. And then you're like, you know what, I'm willing to take this over that. And because it's Better the devil, you know than the angel you don't. So instead of going out and looking for something else and all that stuff, you're like, Well, I mean, you know, I always have my own little space over here. And I have this and that. And so I'm going to believe the height when, you know, whatever they tell me, oh, here, we're gonna put you through a development program, Oh, I gotta stay because I'm going to development program. And once you have already gotten a promotion, you don't need a development program has already developed
Kandice Whitaker:part. quickest way to get a raise and promotion is to get another job. And in the relationship scenario, you stay with somebody just because they have money. But then you have to put up with them. Looking at other people while they're sitting with you. That's not gonna work for me, because I'm a catcher case. Yeah, yeah, that makes this respect for me.
Terry Johnson:very disrespectful. But because of the price of money, you feel like it's okay.
Kandice Whitaker:And nothing free. Grandma said ain't nothing free. And
Terry Johnson:thinking about work. As you know, Brenda, you mentioned it a couple times in a previous segment as well, like work is a relationship. So it is essentially the same thing as us going to date somebody. So when you're going out to look for jobs and stuff you do, you ain't should do it the same way that you do dating. The problem is, though, is that people don't understand how to do dating well, so to make that as Yeah, pickers versus actually dating. That's why you find these toxic environments, and they become a toxic person as a result.
Dr. Brenda Carter:That's a great somebody for our listeners. Are is your spouse or your partner? Is that the same as your business? Like do they will place you work for your employer and your significant other? Do they share similar traits?
Kandice Whitaker:Do you really want to ask that question girl. We're going down a slippery slope. But see, I love the train that you're going on. Because last season, did a whole episode with my girl talking about getting your corporate Hold on, I think where people mess up, is they know how to use those dating skills to go from person to person to get what they want. But use them same skills and corporate, to secure your back. Stop wasting your time when people ask you children. Oh, and use them same skills to get you some money, some money, stop wasting your time when people ask you children, but I do 100% agree those vetting things that you use in dating definitely come into play in corporate. But I think the thing that we're not saying is that somehow along the line, and maybe it came along with this whole code switching thing, a lot of us come to the table, feeling like we're not at the same level of the organization. You know, our esteem is not at the level where we are questioning as well. Right? This should be a 360 evaluation, you ain't gonna be shooting all the questions off, let me know, I need to know what you bring into the table to my life as well.
Dr. Brenda Carter:Now watch this though, this is where we add a little bit of the G code right. Put it on there. All right. So just like when you day in, are you got friends? No, no know what it is. So if you if you okay, you need that job. Right, you may not have the luxury of turning nuttin down right now, okay. But know what it is. According
Terry Johnson:according
Dr. Brenda Carter:to when you know, when you talking to them, and you know, that certain type of vibe, get their head get that bread didn't leave.
Kandice Whitaker:That's it and that's all
Terry Johnson:you right? And that's what it should be honestly, you know, and I and I can say for myself, there was a environment that I was in recently that I just got out of, because of the same reason, but I knew what it was it was getting that bread getting there. Hey, Ben Lee. I wanted to go but it just comes down to you know, sometimes you got to do things to get to that place. That's absolutely right. But stay authentic to who you are, why you're working towards getting there. change the course of who you are as baby,
Kandice Whitaker:I see a t shirt on the horizon and get that head get that bread and leave.
Dr. Brenda Carter:Right so let's cast the vision real quick. When we say lead, we're saying lead to go on to better lead to get to where you're supposed to go on life leads into that leadership role where you can start impacting change with somebody coming after you doesn't have to go through what you did leave to make it better. Right? Absolutely. It's like, it's,
Kandice Whitaker:but don't forget to help people along the way. Yes, you gotta reach back and help.
Dr. Brenda Carter:Right? You are doing this for those behind you because you shouldn't be causing change. The reason why we're able to get here is because someone calls change before us, we're trying to cause change for those that are coming behind us. So it's do it with a purpose not just to be all willy nilly do it with a purpose. Don't be you know, throwing that whole bag out there just all records like
Kandice Whitaker:put the thing down, flip it and reverse it.
Terry Johnson:I mean, I get it every now and then if that's how you starting out, but that should be your early years in life, your early career years of being a, you know, hope for a job. But you know, you start to grow up and you want something serious, just as you do when you mature in dating, like you want somebody that's serious, you know, you want a man that's going to show up for you and like, you know, be that guy for you. You know, it's the same as a job. You want a job that's going to give you that flexibility gives you that good PTO and that good paycheck. growth opportunities and opportunity to impact your profession in a way that you know someone else before you wasn't able to
Dr. Brenda Carter:write. Yeah. So get that head. Get Everett, delete
Kandice Whitaker:and leave. I want to thank you guys, my co host, Dr. Brenda Carter. Thank you so much. Terry Johnson where can people find you on socials? I know you're a therapist. So y'all be like a cog negro.
Terry Johnson:Under theory, Jocelyn, as well, I'm on Instagram, under Scotty underscore.
Kandice Whitaker:Thank you guys for listening. I love you when I mean it. We out. Wasn't that a great interview? Hold up before you grab your hat and head out. Make sure you make your way to facebook and join the bail yourself out pod Facebook group. That's where you'll find your virtual co workers, luxuriating and chatting. Thank you so much for listening. And if you enjoy the show, please leave a review. That's how we keep the lights on. If you're on social media, follow your girl Kandice with the K Whitaker. And you know what, I'd love to hear from you with that. I love you. And I mean it because there are people who hate in the world for no reason I choose to love for no reason. I believe as the great Martin Luther King Jr. said hate is too great a burden to bear so I choose to love the show.