The Election 2024

The conversation on the "Bail Yourself Out Happy Hour" podcast delves into the aftermath of the 2024 election, focusing on the reasons behind Kamala Harris's loss. Key points include the role of white women and men in the election, the impact of misogynoir and racism, and the messaging failures of the Democratic Party. The discussion highlights the need for better messaging, consistency, and community engagement, particularly among black men and women. The conversation also touches on the challenges of cancel culture, the importance of critical inquiry, and the need for Democrats to adopt long-term strategies and early investments in social media to counteract Republican tactics. The conversation revolves around the aftermath of the 2024 election, focusing on the perceived failure of progressive policies and the lack of action on issues like genocide. Speaker 2 criticizes white leftists for their late realization of systemic issues and their selective concern for Palestine without addressing other genocides. The discussion highlights the challenges faced by black women in navigating political landscapes and the consequences of electoral choices. The group also touches on the impact of social media in raising awareness about issues like Palestine and the importance of education in combating racism and othering. The conversation ends with a call for meaningful engagement and allyship.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Intro
• 2:15 Campaign Strategies and Messaging Issues
• 4:39 Bernie Bros and Leftist Critiques
• 6:34 Third-party Candidates and Voter Turnout
• 55:37 Challenges for Black Women and Men in the Election
• 1:02:00 Future Strategies and Messaging for Democrats
• 1:02:16 Cancel Culture and Critical Inquiry
• 1:02:30 The Role of Social Media and Influencers
• 1:05:04 The Importance of Consistency and Long-Term Strategy
• 1:05:31 Final Thoughts and Next Steps
• 1:05:45 Election Aftermath and Black Women's Perspective
• 1:07:06 Russia and Ukraine Concerns
• 1:07:54 White Guilt and Black Women's Knowledge
• 1:10:42 Navigating Anti-Blackness and Genocide Concerns
• 1:12:42 Education and Overcoming Racism
• 1:17:34 Friendship and Politics
• 1:18:58 Closing Remarks and Social Media Presence

Transcript

0:01  
Kandice, welcome to the bail yourself out Happy Hour Podcast, where each week we'll help you navigate the corporate jungle. Here's your host, Kandice Whitaker,

0:12  
welcome to the bail yourself out Happy Hour podcast, friends. Here we focus on personal growth, career growth and entrepreneurship. Our family, who are your virtual coworkers, are dedicated to providing you with the tools and insights to turn your dreams into reality and help you get your money up. In each episode, we'll explore strategies rooted in my framework, the bail method of resilience, designed to guide you in conquering challenges and thrive. I'm your host, Kandice Whitaker, and at the age of 21 I was a determined young mother of two who wanted to ensure my best possible life and defy the odds. So I took steps towards achieving the life I desire. I got my master's degree. Then I was a sought after consultant, which led me to starting my own company. I have a passion for helping people live their life to the fullest through resilience, using the bail yourself out approach. So I'm happy you're here. Kick off your shoes and relax your feet. Fill up your favorite drink, because the bail yourself out Happy Hour podcast is about to start now. Hey, y'all Hey, welcome to the bail yourself out Happy Hour podcast, y'all so we have a special edition of bail yourself out today, and I got a whole lot of friends in the lounge chilling with me today because we got to talk about this election. So y'all know the crew from my mic sounds nice. We got Aaron Lloyd, Tim Jones and Kev Williams. Welcome.

1:42  
What's going on? Glad to be here with you.

1:44  
We got a new friend. You probably have seen her on social media going off about something another Elizabeth Booker, Houston, I love her. She is going to add to the conversation, and I am looking forward to what we going to talk about today. From your perspective, what the hell happened? And imma give Liz first, because ladies first

2:06  
dropped them heat rock list.

2:08  
So I went off a little bit yesterday in the video where I talked about this, because I said, I'm tired of seeing the think pieces of people talking about how in 107 days, she could have ran a marginally better campaign, and one she wouldn't have. I said, I think of Gavin Newsom got up there and ran like the same exact campaign. He would have won. He would have won in a landslide, because you need a white asshole male to come up there, and that's what it is, misogynoir, misogyny and racism. That's why she didn't win. And folks keep wanting to make all kinds of excuses, like, I've talked to a lot of different folks on my platform. I've talked to people from the uncommitted movement. I uncommitted movement. I've talked to people like Claudia de la Cruz supporters. And I said months ago, I was like, it's not going to be those third party voters that make the Election lose. It's going to be white women. And I said it, I was like, it's going to be white women. Like, again, it's going to be white women. And that's exactly what happened. So white women and white men and racism. I know people are confused about why a whole bunch of people stayed home, and I think that's the second part of the issue, because there were a lot of people who just like, straight up, did not vote, especially compared to the the last election. And I think that was a messaging issue on Democrats part. And I've been saying this to them. I'm like, You need to start talking to people like they're stupid, like the Republicans

3:17  
do. You know, Liz, when I said drop heat rocks, I didn't know you were going to drop some real heat rock because you came out swinging. I said on our pod months ago that I thought we needed a white male to beat Donald Trump. That white male I said, was Gavin Newsom. I was just arguing with Kevin earlier this week. I didn't think that Kamala Harris was really able to coming out of the convention run an effective campaign. You couldn't get to know her. She couldn't build up. There was no book written before the campaign. None of the thing that normal people get when they run for an election. So she was behind the eight ball from the jump. I said this on our pod earlier this morning. I think that white women and black women, historically in this country, do not have a synergy, even despite the misogyny and patriarchy that we live in the women's live movement, even where that was approached, it was approached differently. There were issues within those groups, and I never felt like white women were going to support a black woman to run for president, and the numbers bear that out. The stats show that white women showed up for Donald Trump much more than we thought, even when they were concerned about reproductive rights, you know, body autonomy, none of that mattered, because

4:38  
they care more about whiteness than they do about themselves. Yeah, yeah, that's what

4:44  
it comes down to. And so everybody's writing all these little think pieces of like, oh, they should have been I just been irritated with the Bernie Bros. They're just like, if she had just appealed more to the left. And I made a video. I said, Bernie is not that left. Bernie is like everybody else. He is exactly like his colleagues. You just like the quirky old. White Man packaging, because the people on the left are not that smart. They think they're very smart. They're just as dumb as the right, and they fall for packaging and how things are said. Like, I literally had someone say, well, Bernie talked about increasing federal minimum wage as a baby. All the Democrats do. They all have been, they all have been for a long time. And Kamala Harris did talk about, she said she talked about, yes, she talked about it. Y'all just didn't like the way it was city, like the quirky old man, they're still so stuck on 2016 I did the breakdown, and I was like, Kamala Harris co sponsored the green New Deal the same day he did. They co sponsored the same bills. As a matter of fact, unlike Bernie, she also sponsored a reparations bill when she was a senator.

5:34  
Wait a second. Is that not white supremacy in another package? It is. It is white supremacy

5:39  
from the left. And I keep explaining, I've had it out with white leftist this whole election season. I'm like, you are just as racist and anti black get out of here and they get so mad. But I'm just like, you got your own stuff to unpack, so y'all are a mess too, just like those people over there, because you over here talking about Jill Stein, and I'm not even going to get into it, because I want to fight that woman, but they do the same things. And I said, if you look at Bernie Sanders, I want to tell you the number of white leftists coming to my page talking about, why did it Biden pack the Supreme Court? And I have to keep explaining, because the president don't have the authority to do that. But I was like, Bernie Sanders is against packing the court your Lord and Savior. Bernie Sanders is against the very thing that on my page about Joe Biden, because they are the same old white men. Bernie Sanders is not that radical, but in their minds, they built him up to be but when you look at his actual record and what he's done and what he stands for, what he says he's for keeping the filibuster, everybody complains about the filibuster. He doesn't want to get rid of it. Bernie Sanders, like has said some crazy stuff, but again, it's all about packaging and the way things are said, how they're saying and that's saying to Democrats, that's why my platform does well. I cuss, I talk very plainly at people. I'm mean, I'm an asshole, and I say things in a harsh way, and I say it bluntly so that people can understand it at a fifth grade level, and beloved or hate it. But when I saw what Trump was doing, I said, I'm going to be like that asshole, but on the left, and that's what I decided to do. And I've been saying this over and over again, the Democrats got to fix their messaging like it's not that Democrats are elitist because people say that, they say that they're elitist. It's not that they're just overestimating how smart the people they're talking to are. And so when you see somebody talking a certain kind of way, when I go into a room and I start talking in a certain type of way, people automatically will say I'm stuck up. And by stuck up, they just mean I'm talking above them, and I'm not trying to talk down to nobody if I walk in, like, when I would do moot court competitions and I do that code switch real quick. Hello. Your Honor. My name is Elizabeth Booker Houston, and I'm here to argue an Administrative Law point when we talk about the case of Skidmore versus blah, blah blah. Like, if I do that right, it's not that I'm actually, like, trying to talk down anybody. I'm just, I'm just speaking in a way that makes it but what happens is people who are insecure, especially if it's a woman, especially if it's a black woman, go, well, you're elitist now you just dumb. Like, yes, your own insecurity you gotta fool with like, I can't. So anyway, I've been saying the Democrats have got to dumb this and water this way down if they want to win in the future, or just get a white asshole like, you have a Newsom to get up there and say the same stuff, because same stuff, because I promise you that white man would have won.

8:07  
There you go. No. When I looked at all the

8:09  
people on the ballot in Maryland, when I voted right, who the hell are all these people, I scrolled for like, two pages of people running for president, only two I actually heard of aside from Kamala and orange dude was silly Jilly Stein and Cornel West. And I was like, Oh, he actually made it on the ballot. But then at the end of the day, when everything was counted up, I saw all these people who didn't have a chance of winning from the beginning, accounted for like, 2 million

8:39  
votes. It wasn't.

8:41  
They weren't on the ballot in New York. Neither one person made the ballot in New York. About Jill Stein, you know, I'm not really bad at our platform. I

8:50  
got mad hatred for Jill Stein,

8:56  
for Jilly manilly.

8:58  
I have, I

8:59  
don't hate all the hate for her. I must like this stick because I didn't see all those names on my ballot. And I live in Maryland,

9:05  
you had to get to page two.

9:08  
No, I just went from the top. I knew what I was doing. That's like, I went in there, like, this, this one, this one, and and that one.

9:18  
Yeah, genuinely curious. Like, what the hell is this next button?

9:23  
I agree with you. I feel like this election was just about vibes. And you know, definitely people are definitely dumb, and they just went for vibes. I like this dude, this guy wants revenge, this guy wants a purge. This guy wants deportations. They felt like they liked that. I had hope. I didn't think she was going to win, but I had hope. I recognized, in my lifetime, there's not going to be a woman of color. It's going to be the president the United States. That's just not happening. I doubt if it'd be a woman, but there's definitely not going

9:48  
to be a woman of color. I think that in some ways, in 2020 Biden needed a black woman to beat Trump, and he chose Harris, Harry. Remember, on our podcast, we were having a conversation, and we felt that Stacey Abrams might have been a more solid, fundamental choice, but then for us as men, it was like, America's not going to rock with all the way there. America is not going to going to rock with an overweight, dark skin, where some are questioning, is she with a man and she would like that wasn't going to be what America was going to allow to stand next to the presidential nominee at that time, Joe Biden, although I felt what she represented was more in tune. So you go with Kamala, then you fast forward and remember first he was saying, I'm gonna be a one term president, because I'm gonna be a bridge. Then it became, well, I'm gonna stay because I'm the only one that can beat Trump, and then things happen

11:02  
sleepy,

11:04  
but I'm saying they but in his Yes. So I'm saying everything I was saying. We asked for no, no. I'm just saying what he was saying before June. I saw before. I'm not going down the rabbit hole of the debate. I'm just saying when he decided to run again, his main push for it was he felt he was the only one that could beat Donald Trump and the Vice President was walking as a vice president should in step with that narrative. Some point that changed, whether it changed with the people. The results say otherwise. I'm just saying to say that there were just so many obstacles that was set up against her. It almost made it impossible, like, I don't think she could have run a different campaign. I think that it just shows where we are as a nation. I think it also just shows that mindset of, oh, we sick boss like to the point that we have more faith in our oppressors ability to lead us than for someone who has come from amongst us to lead us. And so that sexism and racism, that was what was on the ballot, everything else pushed to the side that and then followed by money, because people believe that this voting for Trump is going to improve my finances, they chose that over the reproductive rights of my wife, aunt, daughters and immigrants that, like everything else, was pushed down to this perception around money.

12:42  
So let's see what happens to your money when you gotta start paying child support for your side chicks, baby that she had to have. They

12:49  
ain't even gotta wait for that. Them. Tariffs are going to hit hard. But did you see their people search for tariffs, and what they do? Like, went way up after the election and apparently, about Trump, traders thought that the other countries pay the tariffs. They didn't realize they're

13:01  
like the American country pay no Chinese companies paying the tariffs. American company paid the tariff, and they're passing on to us like that. It just

13:10  
these people have no sense. This is why I get back to the dummy gun of America. George W Bucha said, No Child Left Behind, and everybody's suffering for it like this is who Republicans know how to play the long but we gotta also

13:20  
stop falling for even narratives that we repeat. Because I'm sorry, Kandice, but you anybody cared about Joe Biden's age? Was you being manipulated by Russia and bots and Republicans? There's no reason for his age to have ever been an issue in this election, because there was not one thing that his age showed as a problem when he ran as president. It was not you didn't go up there one day and say, Wow, that Bill fell apart, or that that he couldn't meet with the Russian president, or he couldn't meet with the with the Prime Minister of Britain because he's too old, or he couldn't go to work on Thursday because, because he's old, he did a job. He did it effectively. He did everything he wanted to do, and they tricked us like they tricked us with Hillary's emails,

14:16  
disagreeing, No, I'm talking about until the debate. Yeah, that's what I'm saying to himself,

14:24  
why you cared about the debate so much? Because they said, No, not you. Not Not you. I'm talking about the country. They cared about it because they were set up for the last 12 months before that. That's

14:39  
what I'm I'm looking forward. I am consistently get old white men out of government like that is my consistency. It ain't got nothing to do with it. I'm not, because

14:49  
ageism seems to be the only ism that we're okay with. Well, we want

14:53  
it's not true. Being overweight too. He said about Stacey getting ready for somebody fat.

14:59  
Yeah, but you couldn't say that publicly. You can. You can talk about somebody's age and and it's talk about somebody being fat too. No, no, you can't. No, you get roasted. You would get roasted publicly. But you could talk about somebody's age till the cows come home. And we're all running to that state of being without knowing anything about it, because none of us have lived it, and we want to shame people age in that building,

15:30  
just logic,

15:32  
and at some point,

15:36  
if somebody

15:40  
tells you at 80, you cannot. You cannot sit there in Congress and talk and be regulating things and talking about explain offense stuff and how we banned them. I wanted to knock them upside the head scene. When you look at the I think that you should be a representative of the people. And when the average age of the people is younger than you are. You are no longer representative of the people. And it's just, it's it was

16:10  
ageism on the young

16:14  
side,

16:17  
because I'm not, I'm not fine with any ageism, but

16:20  
because when I was 25 I got told I was too young a lot of times, yeah, and then it wasn't until I started dressing in fact, I'm older.

16:27  
I'm not that I gotta I'm not okay with any ageism. I

16:30  
just, I just think, Aaron, to your point, it's like, okay, we haven't been that age, but we have all had parents and loved ones. All I'm saying is it's, I think, with Biden, whether it ever comes out or not, there seemingly was a regression in his Ronald

16:51  
Reagan. A Ronald Reagan had legit dementia. The West Wing is run by 1000 people. The President is a office. It is. We were not at risk of anything negative happening because of Joe Biden's age. I'm not. And if we understand how the executive office works, all I'm saying to y'all, all I'm saying to you all is this very simple. They did it with Hillary, they did it with Biden, even if we were supposed to care about it a little bit, they made us care about it exponentially, disproportionately to what the problem was. They are going to do

17:37  
it. But when you, when you say, when you say they, who's the they are? You talking about Republicans,

17:42  
Russians, foreign actors, bots.

17:46  
Okay, so what about the Democrats? Because it was the Democrats that really pushed him to step down.

17:51  
No, they did that. In the end. You had to do it. Aaron, I'm

17:56  
sorry I didn't

17:57  
say that. No, no, wait, I didn't say they didn't have to do it at that point. What I'm my point specifically, is this, we need to be aware every four years, or when an election comes, they are going to drum up something fake. They're going to make us care about it disproportionately. They are going to make bring our attention to the right when we should be looking to the left. Again. It has undermined our candidates for the last 20 years, and Biden's age with the latest example of it, they do it every four

18:32  
I don't think it was I don't think it was fake, and I think it was his health. I think it was health more than his age. I think you're beating from of the age, because Trump isn't that much healthier same

18:45  
age. Yeah,

18:46  
what Biden has is a speech issue with where he's not as speech a fluency is lower one he's always had that

18:58  
cognition the

19:01  
presidency is an office, and you said there's other people working there who hires them, right? I have heard not even that the President a commission, a president picks, picks certain people, who then go pick certain people, and it trickles down. There was a real problem and complaint from people within the White House and staff within the White House saying there's a lot of folks being picked for stuff that don't need to be here. And it comes down to a whole other that was an effective presidency. It was ineffective. I'm not saying that,

19:30  
but we're not saying it should continue. I'm on 10 toes down. I don't think Biden's could have kept it rolling.

19:36  
You gotta be waiting.

19:37  
I need to go.

19:38  
And the thing is, none

19:39  
of y'all could tell me what, it's not the job man, after the debate, job interview. Listen to me after the debate. There's no way in the world you can look at that and be like, You know what? I'm signing up for, that for four more years,

19:52  
like you have four years in them, and we talk about

19:56  
in 1960 during the presidential debate. But. Between Nixon and Kennedy, Nixon looked a mess, and they say that's why Kennedy wound up winning the race, because Nixon looked a mess, even though everybody respecting Nixon, to me, it's we're all visual. We started talking about how things are visual, social media, yes. So there's no marketing. You cannot overcome that. Kevin,

20:17  
he did it to himself,

20:18  
even in the debate. As Tim pointed out, his recollection of the facts and staying on message and answering the points and showing demonstrating knowledge existed throughout the debate, there was only one person who couldn't stay on message, who couldn't answer questions and who was crazy. I didn't say he was the 45th

20:39  
and 47th president of the United States. Because what it comes down to is you are thinking logically like an intellectual. And we just started talking about this pod about how people are stupid, so they're looking at packaging. They're looking at that's the issue of Biden. We're not saying he wasn't a good president or that he couldn't have continued, because I agree with you on that. I think he could have done a good job as an intellectual, but looking at what the American public wants, as my friend AB said, she said that boy over there talking about Donald Trump, he got 17 words in his vocabulary, but those people hang on, all 17 of his words? Yes, no,

21:08  
no, I agree. But my point is, if we don't see the map truck coming every four years, we are going to continue to lose elections because we're going to be distracted. Okey doke, focusing on things. I'm not saying that his age wasn't even a small issue. What I'm saying is that the amount of belief that people think it was an issue, what doesn't stand up to the facts of him doing his job, him knowing the information, and him being effective.

21:39  
So the question is, how do we fight your real statement is, how do we fight the misinformation campaign? How do we message? How do we make sure that people understand what we're doing for the American people know what

21:50  
imma do in four years. Imma pull it. Wait a second. Imma go run for the Republican presidency. Imma get them to put my my good talking black ass up there and act like I'm on their side. And then imma get up in there and this? We're

22:05  
gonna take a break right here. When we come back, we're gonna talk about All right, what are we gonna do? We got four years to get our ish together. We'll be back. You.

All right, y'all we are back in the bail yourself out Happy Hour podcast, yo, so we talked about what happened this week at the election. Oh, Lord, there's so many things to talk about, but let's turn the page a little bit like, where do we go from here? How do we reconcile where we are now and get our stuff together for at least two years from now, when we're voting for some more people in the House and the Senate? I mean, because we got a red landslide, and that's the part that's scary to me. Honestly, President is one, but now we talk about President the House and the Senate,

23:10  
I feel like we tend to unite at our best when there is a very clear perceived enemy, and sadly, I think it's going to have to get really real. You know how we say things twice to put that emphasis on it like it's already real. But come January, 20, some of those executive orders, some of the things that he was talking about, and if they become policy, then it gets really real. Then I think people will begin to unite, because sadly, pain is a uniter at the worst parts of the pandemic. People got together when situations present themselves like that. So I don't

23:53  
believe there was actually a pandemic and we weren't. It's

23:57  
a wait and see, but I think it will be the opening of a lot of people who cast their vote the Republican thinking one thing, and then that not coming to pass. So like, if the economy doesn't turn and prices are still high and the tax breaks are still really just going for the wealthy. So then you gotta ask yourself, the reason that you cast your vote, even though we're speaking macro, it's really micro. For the most part, you really voted because of what was important to you and what you think is going to be best for you. Now, if that doesn't happen, then how do you process that and or even if it's just happening for you, but everybody that's around you is catching hell, then eventually that hell's going to come to your doorstep.

24:44  
I'm a little more pessimistic. I think he's just really good at blaming other people. There's going to be somebody's going to blame the liberal judge appointed by Obama is the one who blocked my that's what he did. That's why they voted for him again, because none of that stuff came to fruition the first time. They keep falling for it. Because. He's pointing his fingers at everybody else. He's always got a scapegoat, and he's always going to find one, because these people are stupid. That's what it comes down to like. And maybe I'll feel differently in a month, because I haven't had a chance to process or take a break or anything. I got a gray hair named Kamala Harris. I've been running all over the place trying to win something that was unwinnable in the first place, and it's just been I'm exhausted, but I think what's going to happen is really no difference on the right I really don't think there's going to be much of a difference over there, because even that girl, like the Nevaeh girl who died in the from the miscarriage because she couldn't get the abortion care and all that her and a mom were pro life, and it seems that the mama and the family still haven't put two and two together. And think they just need to sue the doctors from malpractice. They haven't. They still ain't making the girl is dead, like, from what I understand, maybe I'm wrong, but what I've heard, they still have made that connection. And it's shout out to Darwin. Darwin Awards are going to abound, for sure. But, you know, we saw people getting Herman Cain awards during COVID. You know, we've already seen this. And so when it comes to people having realizations, I think what it's going to come down to come down to is really for people on the left to learn how to get their stuff together, because one of my friends reminded me of that Bill Clinton quote that Democrats fall in love and Republicans fall in line. I'm hoping people on the left learn how to fall in line and learn like you. Ayanna Pressley said, perfection is not on the ballot, but progress is and a whole lot of people didn't hear her, and they were waiting for the perfect candidate. They, like people on the left are so good at undercutting ourselves by looking for perfection in every single way. The first thing that's going to have to break that down, though, and I'm still getting it in my comment section, is the people, as they call them, the faux aggressives, who use Palestine as their excuse for everything in this situation, I've had people still come to me talking about, well, we weren't voting for a genocide or and my response has been, I need you to go protest that man on Pennsylvania Avenue on january 20. I need you to go practice protest. I need you to go over there because I've been very pro Palestine this entire time. I'm also not stupid. So I understand that we had two choices, and I understood one choice was going to do versus another. And there's a lot of people on the left who really convinced themselves that they were somehow making a better choice and not thinking practically. There's too many people who are stuck in the theory in their minds, and a lot of people who also are so angry that they're like, We want a revolution, but they don't even know how to like order something over the phone without having a panic attack. Like they don't even know how to talk to people in their communities, and they just spend all day scrolling Tiktok. So I don't know how they think they're gonna have a revolution, but like a whole lot of people on the left, are gonna have to have to figure out how to get some skills and come together and join together and actually, like, put in some work and stop falling for this, because you can't tell the difference between a glass of water and a cup of piss. Like, that's what it's going to come down to. For me, I

27:32  
think that the Democrats were horrible with messaging, horrible and getting out the message horrible and actually letting people know how policies and things have impacted them in positive ways. And I think of a majority analogy of the tortoise and the hare, where the hare Republicans did. They started the Heritage Foundation, the John Birch Society, Federalist Society, all of these organizations. For years, they've plotted their way through. They've continued to plot and keep moving and keep moving. And for whatever reason, we do something quick, start, oh, we got an Obama in office kind of stopped, you know, and then, oh, you know, now it's a problem. Oh, yeah, Hillary, Hillary. Oh, that didn't work. Then we raise up. Okay, raise up. We get Biden in office. Then we turn on him, kind of turn your battle. Show up to vote, and it's continuing. We're not driving policy discussions. We're not talking about why our policies are better. That project 2025, is crazy as it may sound. Think about the effort and time it took to them to devise and come up with this is how we want to do things. We can't even do that around abortion. We can't even do that around education. We're not like there are so many things. We're so disjointed. I go back to, you know, I started, I worked with a political think tank when I first graduated college down in DC, and the amount of influence and things that's possible is amazing, and we don't take advantage of that. We're not we're doing it in very disjointed way, and until we kind of get that done, we're going to continue to run this up and down cycle where they have been consistently doing their work. They know

28:48  
the long game. So I heard three words in what you guys said so far. I heard we have to work together and gather. I heard messaging. We got to get better at messaging. But then the biggest thing is continuity. I think the problem is that we keep restarting. And as Elizabeth said, the Republicans got the long game on lock. How do we get some stick wickedness, as the old people used to say,

29:11  
I mean, I think it's even more than that, though, because black men have been leaving the Democratic Party for, you know, over a decade now, and we have to answer that in our own communities, like, what is going on? You know? Why is this occurring? Why do they feel like becoming a Republican or sitting out is a better choice for them? And I think until we know those things, I don't even it's like, until you know why the patient's sick, you know, how do you diagnose it beyond black men? No, I think Democrats have known for 30 years that they're not good at messaging. You know, we've known it since before Bill Clinton and Bill Clinton answer, which I think worked then, but has led to our ultimate downfall was for him to not fight for democratic values, but was to move center triangular, yes, and once he did that. That once we lost words like liberal and let Republican branded as a negative word and not fight back, Republicans have been doing that, and they continue to control our message and the things we believe in, and until we can control our own messaging, until we feel comfortable standing on the things we believe and also being able to convince people of these beliefs, we're going to have a major problem. They're

30:25  
not even trying something

30:26  
else that presented itself, and it would lead to a whole another discussion. I think the Republican Party has totally hijacked and almost destroyed what is perceived as faith, and in particular, from a Christian standpoint, of which I am So Aaron, and you were saying, like, there's some conversations that may be to be internal before it's external facing. And you were talking about black men and black women, there's some real hard conversations within the church that has to be had because what just took place, not that what took place was brand new, but like we were speaking earlier, I think things are now amplified to different scales because of platforms and social media and sound bites. And as Elizabeth was saying, and I hate to fully agree, the level of stupidity that people operate on where no to the point where it's like you will take a post and make your whole view based on that post, you won't even scroll to see if there was a part two to the post. And so I think there's honestly some internal, reflective conversations that have to happen otherwise, the uniting just to not be like them doesn't work in the long run, because even Kev to what you were saying, and I was sitting here like, wow, really, what are democratic values like? You know what Republican values are? So if you're choosing that you those aren't your values and your belief system. You at least know, with the Democrats and then the Republicans, to your point a I think they did a massive job at presenting the Democrats as confusion, not organized confusion, because then we would rock with them, because that's hip hop. But so, you know, so I think in that standpoint, it's like, okay, it's one thing for me just to be anti but that doesn't necessarily mean I understand what I'm for.

32:26  
Well, you said, what are democratic policies values? What are democratic values? Because we know what Republican values are. No, we don't. We actually don't know what Republican values are. They lie and say that it's this very reductive thing, and that's their messaging. Democrats, like I said, are still thinking too cerebrally, and so they're like, Oh, we want to acknowledge all the nuance and all the things and diversity and all of that. That's why we don't know what the values are. Because there's so many different people. Republicans know that there are no true like, stagnant Republican values, but they don't care. They pick a message with those 17 words and they put them out there, and that's it. And that's why they get in people's brains and, like, really, like, really, like, get that across, and it all just comes back to that communication. Because when you actually talk to Republicans, like one on one, they're all going to tell you something different. Like, they will all tell you that that something different, and have no idea that their party is doing the opposite of what they think they're doing. Like, they really do not know,

33:18  
but to some level, they know that is in their best interest to not speak against the master narrative, I think, in

33:24  
terms of a platform sense these things that whether they believe it, act on it, they get the credit for believing in a Christian family values, family values, being tough on crime, going to church. You know that God created a Christian America, not freedom for religion, but Christian America. You know, business. You know, pro business. They get credit for these things when Democrats are pro business. You know, Democrats don't want crime. But I think the things that Republicans also do if they wrap themselves around things that are easy to get behind and also think that you can make other things negative. So they can be against other religions, so people can get behind that. You could be against criminals, so people can get behind that. You can be against gay people, against gay marriage, against they do a lot of against and it's easy for people to get behind being against something, because it doesn't require, as Liz has been drumming home the point accurately, that people are not sophisticated in their thinking. And it's easy for me to say, Oh, I hate this, or I dislike that, or I'm against this. And it's very simple, and it speaks to this, the simple mind that she pointing out exist in this country. So people

34:45  
like being in groups of people who are like

34:47  
them. That's about being alike. They're so sneaky that they say we are a Christian nation and we are against these other religions, especially the brown ones. But the second lady is about to be Hindu. That's how sneaky they are. Yeah. Why it's a lie, like it's so crazy they can do that, and everybody's just like, oh, yeah, but, but still, though.

35:06  
And to your point, then when it's convenient, they'll lift that up, which is why the President is ghetto. But when it's not, it's like, Yo,

35:15  
I believe in family values, but Donald Trump, you know, had affairs. You know, intended about genitalia, and

35:23  
then the response is, Well, everybody's not perfect as we're getting older. I also think around the messaging being a Democrat, but I don't think a lot of us, as we are aging, are as liberal as the messaging that's coming from the far left, not that it's pushing people to the Republicans, but I could see a lot of people just kind of feeling because I'm black, and I know that the Voting Rights Act, not the law. The Voting Rights Act is only 60 years old, and I'm 56 and my parents were born in 41 and 42 so I'm always going to go to the poll because I know that when they turned 18, they couldn't vote. So if both candidates in my heart of hearts were just evil, I'm still going to exercise my right. But I also know that a lot of people don't think like me, so I can see people falling back and not participating because they don't feel like Kandice to you said, like people tend to want to get in community where they feel we have something in common that is worthy of unifying about thus you get the word community. But

36:33  
one thing that the Democrats have in terms of messaging, and it may be unintentional messaging, whatever is the new flavor, whatever is out in popular culture, we got our ears to the street, real anything that comes out. Oh, welcome into the gender reassignment surgery. We on that. All right, yeah, we for that, whatever. And as you were saying, Tim, a lot of people are slow to accept new things. And it just seems like our team, whatever hits, all right, boom. People are into that. Okay, yeah, we accept that. All right, cool. We in, yeah, within the

37:09  
black and brown community, I remember, like the think tank that I worked for was the Joint Center of political and economic studies, largest black think tank in the country, first black Think Tank. They came around to support newly elected officials in the 70s, to help train them to be politicians, and used to do studies and things all the time. And one of the things that always came across is black people are socially conservative. Yes, that's a conservative. That's facts. Now, the only reason you know we seem to be liberal is because we want our rights. We want our rights protected. We want our

37:37  
rights that that's liberal. That's the core problem, but that's kind

37:42  
of always what it's been and when you go to the message, and I'm thinking about and Liz, when you were talking about the people on the left, I live here in New York, live in the Bronx, I remember 10 years ago, my man was running for mayor, the rent is too damn high. People loved it. Yeah, that's all he said. That's all he said debate, the rent is too damn high. My man had a

37:59  
dude that got federal charges right now? Yeah, that dude, that dude, right? He

38:03  
was loved in New York. He's getting votes. People like rocking with him and wanting to support this guy. And it was all the simple message, and it goes to being against things.

38:12  
It's pleasure, exactly, and

38:14  
that's what I said, bring it back. I don't really just have no beef with Bernie Sanders, but I just have beef with the Bernie Bros. And they keep talking and I'm like, nothing works like and I brought examples people like he said, No. He didn't like they. Sometimes he didn't say, I'm like, no. This is the direct quote of what this man said about how the Supreme Court works, and it was wrong. And he had no answer of how he was going to protect abortion rights, because he said he would rotate the Supreme Court justices to another court. You can't do that. That's not a thing with the cost. He said it multiple times that don't even know that. Nobody knows it, because his messaging is so good. He's the rent too damn high guy, just not as crazy, but he really is like Bertie just says, oh, you should get health care. We all deserve health care. There's that Medicare for All Bill was scant. It had nothing in it that would ever go he didn't have no appropriation section. Go look at his record, from what he's gotten past as long as he's been in Congress, he is an establishment Democrat, just like all the others, but the messaging has left us thinking, Ah, he's a revolutionary, and I'm like, Baby, no, he's just an average white guy in Congress. He really is. You should demand better

39:13  
for yourself. He's not even a Democrat. He just come to the party when he caucuses

39:16  
with the dems. But that is part of the messaging him. Remaining as independent makes it seem like he's different, but substantively not. And I said, y'all don't actually care about substance, and that was the problem I had so many people. Let's say, well, we want to see policy. No, you don't, baby. No, you don't. No, you don't. Because when I show you all of the examples of when it was said and how it looks exactly like the person you say is so much better, and it's like word for word, like the same stuff, you suddenly fall back and get confused. You don't actually care about substance. You don't you just want to feel good because the rents too damn high and healthcare is too damn expensive. And that's the messaging that Democrats are gonna have to give with. They're gonna have to find their 17 words. That's what it's gonna come down to democracies to find their 17 words. I

39:58  
don't see how they can do it.

39:59  
I got somebody. Is you

40:02  
gotta stop talking about the Big 10, because the Big 10 ain't that big as we see it after this election. Yeah, I can't

40:07  
see the public message of the Democrats being against. And then if we do have that, that the Republicans and the Democrats are really on some going after each other like that, I don't know how long this thing stays together. I'm already concerned about how long this thing stays together.

40:22  
I mean, nothing lasts forever. And I mean, and you see, like the path that we're going on is there's been similar countries where this is where this has happened, and we kind of know what happens. I would have

40:30  
banded against white supremacy. That would have been my Democrat messaging is white supremacy, because that is the credit spreading Republicans do. And I would have had all these poor white people come up and go, yeah, they think they're a supreme percentage of white people, but what about all this other white people who are average white people and blah, blah, blah, one, they're hurting us. And I would have put a whole bunch of white men all up in there telling everybody, that's one of the things I would have done, because

40:53  
that got Martin Luther King smoked when he started doing that.

40:57  
Yeah, yeah, we cooked anyway. So you're

41:00  
right. Dr King did that there and then, from the faith standpoint, the letter from Birmingham jail that when you start making these issues not categorized by race, then you become dangerous. Dangerous. Yes, dangerous, no, flawless to Earth, that's when you become dangerous.

41:20  
So there's a thing when it comes to rights, kind of just kind of civil rights, or just black people, people of color. You know, white people only move when there's interest convergence. You know, when their interest in our interest. Graham style, now I gotta do something now. I see at this point in time, the way society is, there's no interest convergence at all. They see everything, anytime we're gaining rights, them losing some anytime where something is codified in law, codified. But you know, by the Supreme Court, or what have you, like they they feel like there's a loss, which is why they continually to going back, taking things away, taking things away. And with the Supreme Court and everything, they were going to continue to take things away over the next four years, just wait and see. So that brings me to

41:58  
the alternative plan, which I've engaged in and I have a white husband, so hashtag black in his bloodline. Just so we gotta take their numbers down. Just keep taking their numbers. Just take them down. Just take them down. Just hold them. Keep getting in place. While Kamala, she got that emotional support white boy of her own, you just gotta, like, get in there and knock their numbers down. That's what we gotta do. Is that true?

42:21  
Yeah, she does have a white husband. Okay, I was asking, she does completely. I

42:33  
was posing a question, because your whole voice changed, and I was like, Oh, this is a strategy moment, so let me pay attention, because I really been learning from you. When I was like, Wait a second, I can't implement that strategy,

42:46  
I hit you with the jokey joke, didn't I

42:50  
appreciate that.

42:53  
I think we're in trouble, because if you don't have a focused place to go get truth, if we don't have a media that the entire country can believe in, and truth can be anything anybody wants, then you can't have a functioning democracy. And I think that's what we're seeing now. I would say we need to spend the next four years teaching people how to decipher information. We have to tell people to ask the second question, the third question, the fourth question, like so you get that Tiktok and somebody tells you something is something you gotta ask the second question, because most of these thoughts and beliefs don't stand up to any scrutiny. Now the problem is the people, as Liz said, and I agree, are often not smart enough to know what that second and third question should be. But most of these things don't stand up to scrutiny, but right now they do,

43:43  
and along those lines, then we also have to attack this notion of cancel culture, because cancel culture has actually robbed our ability for critical inquiry. Yep, and I

43:56  
don't like that, you're canceled. You hurt my daily

43:59  
and it limits who we talk to. We have to have classes. How do you have a conversation with someone that may disagree with everything that you may think about, but you still want to have that conversation? Well, how do you have that conversation with where in your perceived mind you don't think that that you have anything in common, but when you have the conversation, you may have more in common with that individual who you think you had nothing in common with than the person who's right next to you that society says you should have things in common with. I

44:32  
disagree about the cancel culture thing because I don't think it exists. I don't think cancel culture is real. And I say that as somebody who's been on social media with like, people with millions of followers and all kinds of people who have come at me and even for like, months at a time and strings at a time, and still not gotten canceled. Like it's not a thing. It's really not. It's people either. I will tell you that nowadays, like, if you look on social media at any of the people on there, where people have come at them for anything, they just get quiet for a minute, and then everybody forgets about it, because you move on to the next thing, people are too. ADHD. It

45:00  
depends on the person, though, Liz, some people, some people, you don't see them anymore. It's not as bad as five to six years ago, but the important

45:10  
but be right, because I think Derek Jackson's ass will come back. It's also

45:16  
not just whether it's real or not. It's Whether people believe it's real. People are behaving as if it's real, and so those conversations aren't had, and people aren't being really frank. I'm not talking about just the outrageous stuff. I'm talking about the smaller conversation between people. I'm not going to say this because I'm going to be looked at a certain way. So I think what Tim is saying is absolutely a fact. In our society, people don't feel comfortable to have frank discussions. I know on our podcast, we had feelings and had to be very clear in what we were saying to be misconstrued. We've talked about women's issues and be like, alright, well, if three brothers, you know, we kind of have to be mindful. There's no women on here. How we talk about this. So it may not be real, but it's real and it's affecting behavior. What

46:06  
behavior is being done as a way to prevent cancel culture, and what's just like preventing backlash? Because people, I feel like people keep conflating those two, and backlash is very warranted, like, if you say something crazy or you do something crazy, and you don't tread lightly, especially if you have a platform, and that's the other side. But too many

46:25  
people got microphones CK Lewis, that

46:26  
CK Lewis should have a career right now. He's

46:28  
got canceled because of what he said. He's canceled because he exposed his genitalia to women and sexually harassed him like I really

46:35  
don't care what he did. Your bad behavior should not stop you from being able to have a career in the future,

46:43  
unless you're president elect.

46:46  
I mean, it's bam,

46:48  
but Louis CK came back. He did his little hiatus, and he came back. I mean, everybody, I don't see

46:54  
him, but his career definitely ain't what it was. That's fine.

46:57  
Because honestly, like, I disagree, because, like, especially if you like, with Donald Trump, you should be canceled and you're not, you're not in and that's the entitlement part of society. Everybody thinks that they're entitled. You're not entitled to No, no, yes, I know. But because cancel culture doesn't come up with, like, it's not really a thing with, say, somebody working at the damn Walmart or something like that. It doesn't have people only bring this up in the entertainment field, and you are not entitled to people,

47:24  
absolutely. But what? What should happen? What should happen is, if I have a problem with you, Liz, then I should say I'm not going to take in our content. Me going out of my way to stop you from having a career. It's too much. I

47:38  
have a follow up question to that. So you don't want people giving good reviews and recommending you to somebody else, either. No, it's not different. Because if I don't like you and I say, This man sucks, and I make a terrible review, what is different about that from somebody going, this man is amazing, and everyone should go listen. Statistically,

47:54  
you tell more people when you don't like it. The

47:57  
difference is, with a review, which I did review before, you have a job, you're listening. You're making a critical assessment. I

48:04  
didn't say a review. I said somebody who's like a fan, who's just going to talk about like, somebody just like, oh my god, this person is amazing, because you can't have one another. You can't have your cake and eat it

48:14  
too. That's different.

48:21  
That's different. That's different than all three kick rock because, because I don't know what you're talking about, we we not even close to that point, there is no I don't even remember my point now, someone telling me I got an opinion about something. It's different than me contacting paramount and saying this person can't have a movie. And the danger in that list is that you have people like my man from what's the brother's name? Oh Nate Parker is one. And then the brother majors, John, John majors. It is not a social media mob out here, uninformed. Going after people and attacking people is a horrible, ineffective way, and it needs to be understood. It's not only it won't stop there. It will come to you someday, and that is not the way you want society, where we are stoning people you know online, because at some point you'll be the stony Sony,

49:20  
because I'm not Tony because I'm not going to expose my genitalia to

49:25  
women or like

49:29  
assault a woman like Jonathan

49:31  
Liz that the line will stay where it is, and the line never stays. The line never stays too or we're only going to do it to people who are incorrect who are out of bounds. That's not how life works once

49:44  
you create that. Aaron, this is high level thinking. We already talked about this. Let me

49:50  
just say something, because I was the one I mentioned cancel culture from a terminology usage. It might have been ill placed. I was more so and but let's. You brought up. Her made it, but from not from an entertainment standpoint, and I was really speaking about it to the point where showing up in these different educational spaces, where it should be the space for the critical thinking, it should be the space that's different to be able to have the questions, and I'm saying, and we are in a time where you can't even pose certain questions without the backlash of judgment, and then subsequently it can impact beyond that, like Case in point, especially last year, this time, even still, but especially last year, this time after October 7, for a lot of people, they didn't understand the history that had been going on that predated October 7. So in some spaces around the country where I traveled to even ask the question, say,

50:50  
What happened to October? Because I know somebody's listening

50:54  
in october 20, October 7, 2023 with the the attack from Hamas on Israel, where, like, think over 1200 people ended up being killed and raped, and then there was hostages taken for a lot of people, that was the introduction to, what is that? What is understanding the conflict? And so what I was saying, to the point where I leave the candle cancel culture, was that if people were asking what some deemed to be the wrong question, oh, you're anti semitic, it's like, no, I'm just trying to find out what's going on. And so that has tend to rob us of our ability to ask inquiring questions. And so you're 100% right. So Aaron, what you were saying, Yeah, to Aaron, what you were saying earlier, like the importance of asking that second and third question. As I move in these more spaces, I feel like you show your intelligence more by the questions you ask than the answers that you have. But if we're being robbed of our ability to just ask a question, I think that hurts us. So that's what I was. That's a

52:03  
whole different setting, and I fully agree. As a professor, I teach law students, and I remember I had, like, a right winger kind of guy leaning and he had concerns, and was because I teach Food and Drug Law, and he was asking about, well, hormone therapy with children and all that. I am very pro trans rights. Okay, so, like, all of this because we're talking about, like, the regulation, about it, obviously, though, as a professor in that setting, yes, I need to give him the space to ask questions. Did I jump down his throat? The Thumbs Shut up. Now, like, we need to talk about this, because this is, I fully agree with that. I think that's a whole different setting from entertainment. If you come to my show talking like that while I'm on stage, I will heckle you and I will shut you up. If you were in my class, over in a setting like where we would have these discussions, a town hall, an assembly, something like that. Fully agree, and it's all about just knowing the context and knowing, like, what setting that you're in as well. But I always hear cancel culture come up with the entertainment setting. I never understand that, because I'm like, and being an entertainer, I'm just like, you're just not entitled.

52:57  
But it blurs into all worlds. It blurs into the regular life. It blurs into entertainment, your job, job, everything. I mean, like, not for nothing.

53:07  
Did y'all see this week cancel culture hit this young white lady in, I want to say, Tennessee, working at the waffle house the day after the election. This gonna post online, which one of y'all going to be my slaves working at the goddamn they

53:23  
may not at the Waffle House, not you being a server at the Waffle House, making 235 an hour plus tips. And you said this with your whole chest, you are literally getting slave wages as an underpaid like you are getting sub minimal wage. And you really said that with the whole chest and bolt titties. Wow, I am just I cannot with people. I don't have

53:45  
a problem with people being punished, but you are not. But I have a problem. I have a problem with people being erased after they're punished. We have a society that doesn't believe in the ability of redemption. I have a problem with a society if I can't come back, but if I can't have a job, where we live in a country where people beat up on their wives every day and go to work at the telephone company, and we're okay with that, where they molest children at home and they go to work and they make a career, and they're okay with that. I'm not saying that anybody's entitled to anything at any employment. None of that is a right. But what I am saying is that when we have a mob of people online who can easily just voice their opinion in the most negative way and interfere with people's lives, you are going to cause harm to the innocent. I'd rather everybody get away with stuff that you harm the innocent, because I think what happened to Jonathan majors is a

54:47  
cancel culture, although it has its negative, it could have some positives, like, oh, girl at Waffle House, her ass deserve to be canceled. I don't understand why anybody is following certain people anyway, but you. Know that's a small digression in terms of where we are in terms of this country. I think it was you, Kev, earlier, you said that you think we will never see a minority woman president in your lifetime. That made me sad, but I don't disagree with you, and so with the conversation that we've had today, I want us to leave here, because we do have a platform, and there are people listening to us, there's hope. I know we gotta lick our wounds and feel better. Maybe it's a little too soon, but by the time they hear this, it'll probably be a month from now, we should be a little bit healed. Where do we go from here? Well, first,

55:36  
I think black men need to stand up and apologize to black women. As I told you, Kandice, I feel like black men feel black women in this election. I feel like black women have stood 10 toes down for black men. Y'all did that for Barack Obama. He showed up and showed out, and we didn't feel, regardless of politics, the obligation from a specific segment of the black male community, the black college educated. Yes, they felt obligated. They showed up. They gave money, they did what they were supposed to. My homie at the barber shop, the cat watching Joe button podcast, nah. They were questioning whether she was a black woman. That

56:14  
as a black woman, I actually, when I especially seeing like the results in how black men voted, I don't have a ton of ire for black men. I really, really don't I really don't need this election.

56:23  
I just wish we would have did better by black women. I think we have a 60 year history, maybe 70 year history, of where black men haven't necessarily been at our best when it comes to black women. And I think this was just a simple opportunity to say, hey, sisters, you know what? We haven't always been at our best. We got you well, Karen,

56:45  
I'll say this. I think part of that has to do with how men are socialized and how women are socialized in the United States, men, and you see it in the results of white men as well. They tend to just think about themselves. Women, we are socialized from children to think of others the community, the greater good. Half the time, when folks tell me, I act like a dude is because I'm more on the side of what's best for me. I'm just saying we're not saying it's right. I'm not saying that it's right. But I also think there are a lot of men, especially black men, who don't think of themselves in terms of the larger community and their impact. They're like, well, I have questions about her and she there's a lot of men that I know didn't vote for Kamala, especially black men, because she's not married to a black man. That offends a lot of black men. Well, well, we went from, it's not the damn business, but it's true.

57:45  
That's real wild for a black man to think and say that, because I know what

57:48  
Yeah,

57:49  
I know what they say, I know what they think, and I know what you do, yeah. And we were, I think it was 13% for for Trump in 2020 and it was 22% maybe this year, with 21% but they're only

58:06  
5% of the total, right? So only 5%

58:11  
I don't think that, had we showed up, we would have swayed the election and we would have won. But what I do think is we would have added to the energy and the synergy to think that help a campaign grow intangibles, like when you look at a Barack Obama rally before the election, or a Trump rally in 2016 this synergy and energy that spreads to people, that influences others, things of that nature, I think black men being more engaged could have aided to that, and maybe They would have. It would have, it would have been a traditional election, as Liz brought up before, and I agree, the fact of her getting this nomination, and the way that she got it, you know, curtailed a lot of that. And maybe black men may have responded differently, rather than being force Fred to understand and know and learn a candidate. I'm just saying, if I look at the the white man who didn't want to rent to you, who doesn't want to rent to your community, had to be sued for it, who called the young brothers animals and wanted them murdered, and they were children, and then even when they found out they was innocent, to Central Park Five, he still wouldn't back down. Still still wouldn't back down. When he demonstrates how we really feels about you and your community repeatedly, repeatedly, and then you won't vote for the sister who's saying, Hey, I got you. And then all the things he did for the black community during this election, the first time, was transactional. He only worked in two ways.

59:35  
He did a lot for the blacks. What are you talking about? Transactionally, he'll

59:39  
do stuff, or if you stroke his ego so transactionally, he did think that might have been perceived good for black people, because he wanted to carry out vote for the next election. The only problem is, this time, he don't need us after the vote, he ain't running. Let

59:55  
me ask you something. Aaron, I've heard this said more than once, a lot of people. Said Barack Obama's speech to black men turned them off. And I was like,

1:00:05  
was he wrong? Was he wrong? A lot of black men

1:00:09  
out there, yeah, clearly

1:00:10  
wasn't offended. No, if you look on social media, they talk about the fact they don't think women can be leaders. There's so much fat so black man nonsense on YouTube and social media. Don't deny it. When you get called out on it, say Yo, and and

1:00:25  
it's crazy talk, because all of us that are married don't, none of us run our house. No,

1:00:30  
we gotta really do with like, a black Barber, and he was cutting some dude's hair, and woman was asking, she's like, well, you don't think it was like something like he changed his mind. I got convinced to 15 seconds, or something like that. And she didn't really say anything. She just said, like, do you think a woman can lead? And he was like, I'm gonna tell you what. I tell everybody else. I'm married, so I'm not answering that question. And she was just like, well, you know, just wondering, like, you know, when you think about women leading? And he just said, Look, I'm married, and so and then he was doing Duterte, and he said, You know what, my wife friends our whole house, you know what? Yeah, you know what? Like, he started to think about his wife, and was thinking about that very thing, and just, you see the flip. And I think, honestly, there were some black men again. I mean, we saw the majority who voted, definitely voted for Kalama Harris. We don't even know about a lot of the ones who stayed home. There's a lot of reasons people stayed home. Some people stayed home because they said they thought she had it in the bag and they didn't need to go out, which was similar to Hillary. There. Hillary. There are some people who stayed home because they said, Oh, the candidates are exactly the same, and they're feeling real. People who stayed home because of pro Palestine and on the far left so they didn't vote. There were some people who didn't vote simply because, you know, voter suppression, you know, caused people not to vote. There's a ton of reasons why people didn't vote, but I think looking at people who did, that's going to be the way that we move forward. And we see three groups in particular, I'll say four, but three were much stronger statistically. And the three strongest stuff we saw how they voted, were black women, black men, Jewish people. And then fourth, not as strong, but still Latino women. And those four groups there, and trying to understand within those groups, I think all four of those groups, because when you talk about people, binding communities together, holding communities together, protection and things like that, Jewish people, black folks and Latina women, it makes sense. And I think going forward, we have got to look at these groups, these demographics, in these communities, and figure out, how do we replicate that everywhere else and in other demographics as well, because folks have no idea how to connect, how to build community, how to go out of their houses, especially after COVID. People are so isolated. Folks are very isolated in their thinking. The number of journalists I even had to correct when they were like, Oh, it seems Democrats really have a lock on the social media space. And I said, Uh, no, social media space is very much taken over by Republicans. And they were like, what I'm like, Yeah, your algorithm is tricking you.

1:02:47  
And like social media you looking at, yeah, and

1:02:50  
it depends on the platform you're using, because some platforms are extremely one way or the other, but overall, right wing, red pill, red meat eating, racist white men are heavy on the internet everywhere, heavy,

1:03:04  
heavy. And that is the thing. And I'm like, we also want grinder. Did you see that on grinder? Yeah, on grinder, they're everywhere. They take over everywhere they're doing. And it's not an accident. Go into the social media space real quick. I had some discussions with some agencies that work with us, and we brought up the issue to them. Of y'all are paying US per post, you will sign me up with, say, like an organization, and you'll pay me money for a video. Right? The Republicans, first of all, do not wait until months out from an election. They sign three year contracts with their social media creators and say, we're going to pay you 10,000 $20,000 a month, and we just want you to post this number post per month. It's not this pay per post thing that they have going on. They spend their money when it comes to again, messaging, and they know that the social media landscape is the newest landscape to try to capture people. And we were telling them like, you have to invest. And that's the other side of it. Is getting Democrats to understand how to invest and invest early and start laying the groundwork early. Because a lot of people like it's one thing, if you paid me, if you paid me to make a post talking about something I've been talking about for four years. Excellent, wonderful, great. I've got that credibility built up when you find a beauty influencer has been talking about politics until all of a sudden, four months out from an election, nobody finds that credible. You have not built up that rapport in that relationship and that community. I have community with my people, with my followers, like I will. I don't always get to the like, the way I check DMS or comments or whatever, or engage with that's a form of community as well. And I think they're still seeing it as passive advertisement, like you're passively sending it home watching a commercial from your sofa, rather than understanding the community engagement aspect that is social media. So there's a lot of things that like, I feel like Democrats have got to learn, but just from like that, because that is the space that I work in, I know that's one big thing that I'm like, Y'all need to get that together. Also, I straight up told them, You have to pay me. Has to pay on top of. My pay right now, and it's got very unsafe, very suddenly gotten very un like it was already unsafe. I was already getting threats and everything all the time, but I am very unsafe now. So I was like, you going to pay me hazard pay? Yeah, that goes back to

1:05:15  
strategy, and that goes back to consistency. I mean, listen, you're speaking my life, right? I'm a change management consultant. So okay, here's where we are. This is where we need to be, and this is how we get to where we are. So basically, we really need to solidify, okay, where's the strategy? But I could tell you for sure, after looking at social media this week, y'all can't rely on black women because we tired of y'all. We're tired. No, for real, we're tired,

1:05:40  
but I'm still doing some of my work, but I had to clap back on the little leftist she made a video, and she said, now that the blue Maga people have handed over the election to the red fascis, can we get down to the real issues of Palestine and me and my friends? Dishes said, Who is we? Yeah, cuz it's not us. It's not going to be black women. Who is we? Because, man, I don't even and I'm still friends. Have you been I'm still doing my fundraisers. Last night, I did a charity comedy show that was sold out for Lebanon. I'm still going to do my fundraiser my part, but I'll be damned if a white leftist bitch is going to tell me what I need to do. And you still came to me with no plan. Because the thing I respond to these people, they said they weren't voting for Kamala Harris because they weren't voting for genocide and genocides their red line. Genocides their red line. And then I would follow up and say, Why isn't preventing genocide, your red line? Why is only stopping when your red line? But they didn't like that answer, but they would say, I'm not voting for I would say, then, what is the plan? Do you have an alternative for us? Can you explain to us? And they never had one, to come to me after this election and still not have a plan and to still go, can we get down to we are not doing anything for you. We had our plan, and you probably didn't like it, but it was the most feasible one, and that was to get her in office. That's what black women were saying. We were saying that this is going to get worse for everybody, including Palestine, if she loses, and she lost so I need you to pull up your bootstraps for that revolution you want. And I want you to go down to that man's house at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue on january 20 and protest him. And I will be watching from the safety of my home while you get stuck under a Capitol Police officer's boot on World Star hip hop. That's what I will be doing. You make your revolution happen. Boo Boo, because we haven't even talked

1:07:15  
about how Russia is empowered. So when they start marching across Europe, has done before. Don't say to us, how is

1:07:24  
Elon Musk on a call with Zelinsky, with the President of Ukraine like, like he's making

1:07:29  
staffing suggestions already. The

1:07:31  
man ain't even in all immigrants,

1:07:32  
an immigrant, an immigrant.

1:07:35  
It's scary. I mean, I don't understand how you could take a stance against Harris and Biden about Palestine and not realize that Netanyahu and Trump

1:07:46  
working together is is scary.

1:07:49  
I mean, Netanyahu might The only limitation Netanyahu now has will be the it's only people that will that's the only thing that can stop him. It won't be America. So, I mean, I think we're in for he has to

1:08:03  
continue to wages for he's in a very similar Trump.

1:08:06  
It's a lot of white guilt. And then unfortunately, the people of color and black folks on the left are just borrowing from that white guilt. Whatever. What happened is a bunch of white people who have voted Democrat every single election, every single time suddenly woke up and learned something that had been going on for a long time that they did not understand. And they didn't understand that the President is the Commander in Chief of the military, and that is their first job is to be a warmonger. And they had it in their minds like, Oh my God, every year I've been voting, or every four years I've been voting for a warmonger. I've never been voting for peace. Oh my god, I can't believe this, and their little brains couldn't conceptualize how they were participating in a harmful system, which is something that black women have always known, which is why we did what we did. We have always known that it harm reduction. We have always known that the system is trash. But a bunch of white people found out that they were disillusioned all this time, and they woke up and decided that Palestine was the way they were going to absolve themselves, and they're never going to do anything to help those people. They're not going to help those people, but they're going to be able to sleep easy at night because they're lying to themselves and pretending that they did something. So that's what happened. Joy

1:09:10  
Reid just posted about that this morning, not about Palestine, but share quote that I will forever use in my life. There was no limitations to white innocence. I was like, damn.

1:09:21  
I mean, I think that that Palestine issue is a good example of the positives of what social media can do in terms of informing people. Because I think there is a large group of college students and uninformed people who had no worldwide understanding of politics in any way, shape or form, who got presented the issue as neutrally as we've probably ever seen it?

1:09:48  
I don't know about that. I don't know about that. I

1:09:51  
don't, I don't, I don't know of a more neutral time. I think it's always been presented in a extremely pro Israel point of view. At. Least

1:10:00  
this time, there's more people inside. You got, yeah, you

1:10:03  
got pictures from inside. You

1:10:05  
got, oh, you're talking about from the people over there. I was thinking of, no,

1:10:08  
just in general, just in just in general, there's more information about the other. There's more information.

1:10:14  
I never, really never had that.

1:10:16  
I said, you know, I'm agreeing with your point as far as that. But to me, it also reflects the positives and the negatives. Because while we're getting that, there's been ethnic cleansing in Sudan off and on for the past 20 years.

1:10:29  
I was just going to say, What about Darfur? And, you know, going back to

1:10:33  
Bucha in 2000 when Bush was running, then they refused to do it because they were getting Intel, yeah, you know. And it's happening right now in alarming levels also, and it's completely ignored and the same anti genocide people, I don't ever hear anybody say anything about Sudan. So are you anti genocide? Are you anti popular? Right? Because we're crazy to say popular genocide. But you know, and when black

1:10:56  
women would bring this up, especially because we dealt with and trying to navigate being pro Palestine, as well as dealing with the anti blackness that exists in the Middle Eastern community. It exists in the Middle Eastern community. So we dealt with a lot of anti blackness as well. So trying to navigate both those worlds and have these conversations, folks will get crazy mad because people have no idea how to approach gray area. And it goes back again to the dummy done of America. It has to be black or white, which is also why the election became black and white for them. They couldn't see any other issue. They couldn't understand that we potentially have now set off a transgender genocide in America because of who we put in power. Like I said, Why is your red line stopping genocides and not preventing them? Right? Like that was the thing I kept asking. Like you're not really thinking, and also you're ignoring a ton of other genocides. You got Tigray, Sudan, Congo, like Darfur, we have all of these other genocides. You, you can't just be like a one track mind about it. But also, I think it's just a lot of people who I'm going to be, I'm going to be real with you the black and white thinking on this was a cop out, because dealing with difficult things and making difficult decisions is uncomfortable, and they didn't like to sit in the discomfort and actually figure out how to navigate a very and I imperfect isn't even the right word, but just a horrible system, right? They didn't want to think about how to navigate it. And like I said, black women, we've been doing this for so long, so when Jillian Manila comes along and says, A vote for me ends genocide, they believe that simple shit the same way that Trumpers believe that he's just going to automatically fix all the groceries, even though we know logically and strategically that makes no sense, that it's not true that a vote for her, in no way was ever going to stop a genocide. But they believed it because they wanted to believe it because it's more comfortable than having to navigate the reality of the world. Yeah. I

1:12:37  
mean, I don't think that Africa ethnic cleansing in any point in American history has ever been something that we've cared for as a nation. Any type of calamity that goes on on that continent is ignored. And the only thing that got any minor attention was starvation, and that was only because of starvation of

1:12:58  
children. Shout out to Quincy Jones, because we are the world, yeah, you know. But other

1:13:02  
than that, oh, rest in peace. We just lost him. Yes, yes, yes.

1:13:08  
Genius. I mean, you know, anybody with a genius, it really

1:13:11  
comes back to just education. You know, I work in the education field for years, and we're not doing a good job with our kids. We're not educating them. And all of that leads to, if you're not educated as a young person, how are you going to be a functioning adult? How are we expecting you to be able to ask these critical questions, participate in these critical conversations, and be able to meaningfully participate in the voting process? But just the ruling of how things going on, everything is black and white in society, in how we've been raised, everything is to be just black and white. You watch a TV show, there's good people, there's bad people. There's no in between. We believe that somebody gets caught doing a crime. This is an evil person. Yeah? We all know, we all know good people. We all know criminals. They're not all bad. Yeah, we other people all the time. So because we do that, Trump other, other, other, other, everybody, and now his minions are going to go on and continue to do that. Now, it's only seemed to work from him. We don't know how it's going to work post Trump, but we don't know. You know, they got four more years to improve it and get better. The

1:14:07  
greatest antiseptic for racism and othering people is first contact. Because generally, when you do that, you're not having a relationship with that community, with people in that community. And when you do, you feel different. The problem is, I don't

1:14:27  
disappointed with a lot of people I grew up with. What

1:14:29  
I will say, though, is that often, if it's limited contact, then you will just give that individual a pass. So you'll be like, okay, you know what? I don't think this person, if the Eddie Murphy is a good Negro, you know, where everyone else is, a bunch of other things and words, but when you actually spend time with people, that generally is that racism is generally less effective and often doesn't survive that contact. Because. Because what that really is about is our livid brain and us having an issue with with separate groups to protect us and make sure we're safe and not die. So it comes up in a form of racism, but it wasn't racism. It would be borders. If it wasn't borders, it'd be religion, it'd be language, it it's it would always be something. And that's really about our lizard brain and our protection to survive is in in the world. But

1:15:30  
I do think we can overcome the lizard brain with enough education and practice, because I'm going to bring it up again. Black women have to do it all the time, like survival. I mean, it's possible to overcome that for sure.

1:15:44  
You know, I'm gonna go back to I was in eighth grade, right? 82 I'm staying in the friend's house, dude, you know, white guy, all the time, hanging out all the time. We did good stuff. We did bad stuff. Cut school the whole night. One night, I'm spending the night at the house. We come out, we walk in, we going somewhere, and he's telling a story about somebody did something to him that upset him, and he said, I'm right next to him. And he says, I don't know this guy. You know, what does he think I'm a nigga? I was like, wait, wait, but you're, you know, you're, you're my friend said, Oh my god, oh my god. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I didn't mean that. Of course, he meant it. You know, I wasn't a, yeah, how

1:16:17  
do I friend do that to me? He

1:16:19  
had limited contact. Kevin, where'd you live? You were one of the few black people in war. But if it was in the School of 100 black people, I

1:16:26  
doubt it, because I went to school with a whole bunch of white people in central Islip, who I'm fucking disappointed in them. Yo, we

1:16:34  
don't have relationships like that. Really, I

1:16:36  
did. Yes, I did. I don't even want to call their names, but once such a bad Trumper, I unfriended her like No, I'm not even talking to you because the way you like black dick and not black people,

1:16:50  
I don't understand, but I'm saying, but I'm saying you don't dislike you don't dislike them, that whiteness is not what offends you. That's what I'm talking about with racism. It should be. It should be, it should behave the behavior that is turning you off, but you're not like you're white. I got a problem with you. What I'm saying is that that generally doesn't survive first contact, because it's BS. And through observation, you can see that it's BS, but

1:17:18  
hold on hold on hold on hold on real rap. I don't need you to be my damn friend if I'm just because I'm not like those other Negroes like I need you to be an ally if you gonna be in my space. I need you to care about the things that are gonna harm me. I need you to care about the policies that happen that will affect me in a bad way if you don't. But people talk about friendships,

1:17:42  
and they talk about this and like, Oh, don't let politics run friendships, baby. I can just choose not to be friends with you because your eyebrows are funky and I don't like looking at you like, there are many petty reasons I could choose not be your friend. Like, people act like friendship isn't an intimate, close relationship that people choose or choose not to engage in. It's like seeing all of the the Trump staffers the first time around, when he was president, and they all were living in the same apartment building pretty much out here in DC, because then nobody liked them, and they complained that nobody here wanted to date them. And it was like nobody's entitled to provide a relationship to you, whether that be friendship, romantic relationship, whatever, matter, like you are not entitled. It's one thing to say that because of your politics, I don't get to, just like, assault you in public, but it's a whole other thing to say I have to be your friend, or in any way speak to you, or have any kind of I don't have to talk to you. I

1:18:28  
have no dog in that fight.

1:18:30  
I'm so disappointed by some of the people that I grew up with who I can show you right on my feet, on Facebook right now. Well, you know what's so bad about Trump? Like, are you serious? Well, they

1:18:42  
don't have any sense. So first of all, it's crazy, because you got these people on your feet, because I didn't flush these people out during Obama years, because I I've been radar. It was funny how y'all were talking about not saying certain things. And I was like, maybe that's also why I can't understand hence the culture, because I don't know what that's like. I just say

1:19:00  
whatever I feel. Um, that's why I like you, though, that's why we're friends. Guys, thank you so much for joining us today, but I want to shout out to the crew from my mic. Sounds nice. Of course, we got Aaron Kev and Tim had to bounce because we talked long today. And then our new friend Elizabeth Booker Houston, who

1:19:19  
brought

1:19:19  
the heat, yes, came straight out. So where can people find y'all on socials? Well, I know my mic sounds nice. Y'all know where you get your odds and whatnot. Elizabeth, where can people get you on socials? Yes,

1:19:31  
you can find me on Tiktok and Instagram at Booker squared, B, O, O, K, E, R, S, Q, U, A, R, E, D. Is a throwback to my maiden name being Elizabeth Booker, Booker, or I got married, you can find me on Twitter, because that's what I still call it at Booker underscore squared. It's the only social that has a different handle, because I believe it's got bail and the first account got

1:19:51  
banned. All right, y'all Thank you for listening. I love you, and I mean it peace. Wasn't that a great interview? Hold up. Before you grab your hat and head out, make sure you make your way to facebook and join the bail yourself out pod Facebook group. That's where you'll find your virtual coworkers luxuriating and chatting. Thank you so much for listening, and if you enjoy the show, please leave a review. That's how we keep the lights on. If you're on social media, follow your girl, Kandice with a K Whitaker. And you know what I'd love to hear from you with that I love you, and I mean it, because there are people who hate in the world for no reason. I choose to love for no reason. I believe that the great Martin Luther King Jr said hate is too great a burden to bear, so I choose to love peace. Y'all. You.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai